The first version of this article was originally published on July 16, 2018, but questions continue to pile in and new ads this week indicate that it’s still being pitched as a “one stock retirement plan” … so today it gets a full update. The ad has gone through some relatively minor changes over the past five years, changing the “catalyst” event and testing out new headlines, and the date for the latest version is now noted as January 2022… I’ve updated this article as of September, 2024.
Alexander Green at the Oxford Club has (another) ad out for his “single stock retirement plan” that’s sending a ton of questions our way — and you can see why. He’s promoting this one stock as being able to deliver a “multimillion-dollar retirement”, and there are obviously huge numbers of us holding out hope that there’s a way to “save” the retirement we know we’re not financially prepared for.
The latest email introducing the ad is trying to catch a piece of the AI wave, even though the ad itself hasn’t been updated — this is what that email says:
“This is what is so interesting about this stock…
“The company is seeing surging sales on the technology needed to run powerful language models like ChatGPT.
“The Chairman of the company says ‘More and more people are using ChatGPT. We expect that in the second half of this year there may be a three digit increase.’
“But that is just a tiny fraction of what this secret company is doing…
“Which is why this stock picking legend went on stage to talk about it, while its still less than $5.”
And in a different email:
“We have uncovered perhaps the most unusual AI stock we’ve ever seen.
“It’s expected to see massive revenue this year – $215 billion.
“The company holds over 29,000 patents in the U.S.
“It pays an enormous dividend.
“And yet…
“It’s ultra-cheap – less than $5.”
We’ll get into that (limited) ChatGPT connection in a minute, but first let’s run through the ad — they’ve called it a “$5 stock” and a “$4 stock” pretty much interchangeably over the years, trying to roughly match reality, but the ad itself still says $4 these days.
Here’s a little taste:
“I’m going to show you how a modest investment in a single $4 stock could generate a multimillion-dollar dream retirement in the coming years.
“I call it the ‘Single-Stock Retirement Plan.’
“Some might find the idea of retiring on one stock outlandish, yet many thousands of Americans have already done it.
“In fact, as you’re about to see, the 20 wealthiest men and women in America today made their fortunes thanks largely to a single stock.”
And he says that if you’re going to retire on one stock like those wealthy men and women did (though they mostly built businesses, they didn’t invest passively in one stock), Green says it has to be “the perfect stock.”
He’s even got a checklist for what “perfect” looks like when you’re seeking this “dream stock” for a one-stock retirement… which is when the clues start to drop in about what stock he’s pitching:
“Leader in cutting-edge technology….
“products used by billions of customers…
“profit margins protected [patents, trademarks, etc.]…
“hundreds of billions of dollars in future sales and profits… contractually guaranteed…
“pay an enormous dividend.”
And he says this “perfect” stock should have catalysts — upcoming announcements that could drive the share price — and that the “one key element” is that the stock must be “undiscovered.” And that it should “trade for a just a few dollars a share.”
The per share business is silly, of course, but investors do get hung up on the idea of paying a low per-share price as a prerequisite for huge future gains. Different countries and different eras have different expectations for “per share” pricing — some large Australian companies trade at what we would think of in the US as “penny stock” prices, for example, and it used to be that most large US companies would aggressively manage their share price, using stock splits, to keep it in the $40-100 range. The market cap and the valuation of the company are what matters most, the price per share is mostly irrelevant.
But anwyay, that’s all a lead-up to this stock that Alexander Green is teasing… what other clues do we get? From the ad:
“I only recently uncovered it.
“And if you move quickly – before an upcoming announcement set for August 20 – this $3 stock could hand you the kind of carefree retirement most people only dream about.”
And then some specifics…
“The company has inked deals with Cisco, Microsoft, Intel, Sharp, IBM, Hewlett Packard, Nintendo, Sony, Nokia and Apple…
“In total, I expect it to receive more than $35.3 BILLION from these partnerships alone….
“According to data from Intellectual Property Watchdog, the firm has quietly amassed one of the largest tech patent libraries of any company in the world.
It has 36,241 patents inside the United States and 108,749 globally.
You can see why the world’s most famed tech companies are all signing blockbuster deals with this little-known firm trading for $4.”
And it sounds like this is not a small company, despite that $3 share price…
“… revenue hit a new record last year and is expected to surge even more in the year ahead.
And I expect the company to hit at least $215 billion in annual sales this year.
“The company pays a big dividend too… 189% bigger than the S&P 500 average.”
I know, I’m still keeping that secret (don’t worry, the answer is coming in a few paragraphs), but the update is that the dividend is still above average, though not as dramatically so, as it was cut in 2019 and only recently was raised to recover to close to that level. The current trailing revenue is just a whisker under $220 billion now, so the average revenue growth rate over the past five years is now down to about 5%.
Why is this stock “unknown?” Green says it “does not trade in a normal way” and it’s not on a US exchange… and, far more mysteriously, that it “literally trades under a secret name.”
So that’s enough to get our answer, I bet, but let’s throw a couple other clues into the Thinkolator…
“”A major multibillion-dollar deal that involves both Apple and Donald Trump is about to bring this secret company into the mainstream….”
That was the spiel back in 2018. By 2020, it had morphed a bit to add some specifics about this company’s US presence, as they were building some assembly plants (though they never really followed through on the big promised factory they were promising in Wisconsin to woo President Trump, that project shrunk dramatically).
And by last year, with this new ad dated January 2022, Alex Green had shifted so that the catalyst is now the Apple Car — here’s how he puts it:
“Nothing is as long-awaited as the Apple Car, which the company has secretly been working on under the title “Project Titan” for many years now.
“But here’s what makes this a big opportunity for the $4 stock I’m telling you about.
“Apple plans to design these cars, but then work with other companies to actually produce them.
“Bloomberg has called Apple’s EV the “Ultimate Prize” for the company that partners with Apple on it… because we are talking about the potential for billions of dollars in orders.
“And it looks like the $4 stock I’m telling you about today might just be the company to do it.
“Remember, this $4 stock already does billions of dollars in business with Apple on an annual basis.
“They are big-time partners.
“There is a lot of trust there.
“And this next step in their partnership… the possibility of this company landing the contract to actually build Apple cars… is as tantalizing as any stock catalyst I’ve seen in years.”
Any other clues?
“… the $4 stock I’m talking about had very humble beginnings.
“It was started by the blue-collar son of a career police officer….
“… he scrounged together $7,500 in seed money and went to work.
“He founded a tech company, but a very different kind…
“He realized that he probably couldn’t compete directly with the Apple, Amazon, Samsung and Google of the world.
“But if he could quietly do business with these tech giants, he just might turn his own venture into a successful company.”
He started out building low-tech computer hardware — stuff like the chassis for a desktop computer — and then aggressively expanded to build and provide components for all kinds of tech products. Green cites a few recent contract examples:
“His company has signed an agreement to build hundreds of thousands of devices for Amazon’s Fire TV streaming line.
“It also recently announced that it will be manufacturing Google’s flagship Pixel 6 phone in a partnership that includes Samsung as well.
“It has a deal in place to build GameCubes and Switches for Nintendo.
“It builds PlayStation 4s for Sony.
“It has a deal with Intel to build CPUs and computer cooling systems..”
And a dozen others, components for Amazon and Nokia and Acer and Nintendo and Apple. All those clues are essentially the same as they were four years ago, with minor updates (the next Google Pixel phone will be the Pixel 8, just to note that they’re a couple years out of date on that clue now).
So who is it?
This is, as several readers have already figured out and as Alex has been teasing in very similar ads for more than six years now, the Taiwanese company Foxconn, known for playing a major role in assembling Apple’s iPhones but also a big supplier to most of the world’s gadget makers. Foxconn is the world’s largest contract manufacturer and one of the largest private employers in China (if not the largest), and is one of the largest tech companies in the world (at least on a revenue basis).
And the “secret name?” Foxconn is the more widely-known name of the company, adopted when they were trying to get more international sales around 1980, and its the name you’ll see most articles use (as when they discuss the massive “Foxconn City” in Shenzhen, which has more than 200,000 workers), but the actual name under which it was founded (in 1974) is Hon Hai Precision Industry, and it’s still listed under that name in Taiwan. You can see the company’s own description of itself on their website here.
So yes, I suppose it’s kinda “secret” that Foxconn, the contract manufacturer that most tech investors have heard of, is actually Hon Hai — though certainly all of the institutional investors who own the lion’s share of this large cap stock are obviously aware.
And yes, it was technically a $3-4ish stock for most of the time that Alex Green has been pushing this ad, though that requires some currency translation — it trades in Taiwan at ticker 2317, and until 2023 was mostly trading around T$110 in New Taiwan Dollars (it was T$82.80 when we first covered the stock in 2018), which in US$ would be ~$3.50 today (the exchange rate has fluctuated over the years, but hasn’t changed all that dramatically). That pricing finally took a big jump in 2024, thanks largely to enthusiasm for potentially improving server sales into the AI mania, so today Foxconn trades at about T$180, or roughly $5.65.
It’s not particularly difficult to trade the stock in the US — there is an ADR representing the Taiwanese shares for US investors, it trades OTC at HNHPF (sometimes has been HNHPD, when it’s trading ex dividend), with each US OTC share equaling two shares in Taiwan. There are similar depository receipts trading in London at HHPD, also representing two Taiwanese shares each. The overwhelming majority of trading volume is usually in Taiwan, as you might imagine, so that’s where the “fair” price is set, but the London and NY trading tends to be very close to that price most of the time, despite the lower volume.
So if you want to buy in the US, technically you’re paying $11 or so per ADR today (or ~$6 back in 2018)… but each ADR represents two shares, so I suppose you can say it’s “secretly” a $5 stock (and was $3 or $4 for most of the past six years).
All that mystery and intrigue is beside the point, though — the question is, do you want to own a piece of this gigantic electronics manufacturing company? Here’s what I can tell you about it:
It’s a big company, the market cap is just under US$80 billion… so it’s not likely to rise 1,000% over the next decade, and it’s not a small cap rising star, even though the share price looks fairly low to those of us who are accustomed to US tech companies who let their per-share prices rise into the thousands sometimes. Hon Hai is the second largest stock in Taiwan, trailing only the massive Taiwan Semiconductor (TSM).
Hon Hai/Foxconn has usually been priced at a steep discount to the broader market, and has usually underperformed the broader market over time. The shares trade at about 16X trailing earnings and 1.5X book value right now, with a price/sales of only 0.4, and the dividend is above average — it’s 3% on a trailing basis now, though the payout varies pretty widely (they pay out only once per year, in August — and the yield has typically been more like 5% for most of the past decade).
That relatively high dividend hasn’t helped the stock much, it has traded in a range of 8-12X earnings for the past decade or so (until this year), and the big jump in the share price in 2024 is the first meaningful share price increase they’ve had in a very long time. Even if you bought at close to the bottom of the market (for Hon Hai, at least) in November of 2008, you would have gains of only 200% over 15 years, including dividends… far short of the 700%+ return of the S&P 500 over that time. And almost 8,000% for Apple, Foxconn’s most important customer, or 2,500% for Taiwan Semiconductor (TSM). Here’s what that looks like on a chart, for the visual learners among you — that’s Hon Hai in purple at the bottom, and the S&P 500 in orange:
In case you’re curious, here’s that same chart for just the six years or so since the Oxford Club folks started pitching this as a “single stock retirement plan” — Hon Hai (in purple) caught up to the broader market’s returns (orange) this year, but there are still big gaps to the performance of TSM and AAPL:
Which does serve, at least, as a helpful start to a thought exercise about who profits from hit products — is it the designers, the developers, or the companies who sell them parts and assemble the actual gadgets? Lots of things go into that, and there are plenty of growing and profitable component makers, and Foxconn has certainly made a profit most of the time over the years, but the two things that seem to me have the most impact on compounding long-term growth in the sector are sustainable brands and some measure of uniqueness.
Suppliers can do very well when their product or chip or whatever is better than the competition, but they also have to keep that edge… or make the component an in-demand brand or a near monopoly, as Intel did 40 years ago with their “Intel Inside” branding campaigns for chips and their tight partnership with Microsoft.
That’s what I’d look for when researching Foxconn… where do they have the opportunity to become more than an anonymous assembler? What’s keeping them from having to compete on price? Perhaps the relatively low valuation is a buying opportunity, since a PE of 16 is still half of where most big tech stocks trade these days — but the valuation has always been relatively low, and is actually on the high side right now, relative to Foxconn’s own history… and Foxconn shareholders have failed to really benefit from sales growth or new businesses or booming iPhone sales for a very long time, trade war or no trade war, COVID or no COVID, AI or no AI.
That leads me to think there are some structural problems behind their relatively weak performance. Is that going to change if they get the contract to assemble an Apple Car or some other new hot product? Not necessarily… the closest thing we have to an “outsourcing manufacturer” for automobiles in the public markets right now is Magna International (MGA), and that stock also trades at about 12X forward earnings, so it’s not like investors are habitually lusting after these kinds of opportunities. And, of course, Green hasn’t updated this presentation since Apple scrapped its ambitions to build a car, which doesn’t help.
Foxconn gets lumped in as the “iPhone maker” by most investors, so the share price tends to react to the iPhone cycle as predictions of huge sales volume send the stock climbing and slower sales, like we’ve seen in recent years, help to pressure the stock… the company is obviously far more than “just” Apple’s main manufacturing partner, though I don’t know if that will help to smooth things or create a real growth trend for the stock.
They’ve been aggressively expanding into new businesses and buying up brands and technologies for a long time… and yet, adding more second-tier brands and low-margin businesses in very competitive sectors hasn’t really given them better profitability. My impression is that the pressure of the low-margin contract manufacturing business, where companies like Apple push them to get costs lower and lower each year, seems to have kept them from showing any real sustainable earnings growth on the back of the growth in the business… so if Alexander Green ends up being right about this being a “one stock retirement” idea, it will likely be because Foxconn starts to get a little more leverage over the actual brands whose products they make, giving them a chance to increase margins… or because they finally move up the “value added” chain a bit, as they’ve been trying to do with their push into the automotive business. I see no sign of that happening in any real way over the six years that Green has been pitching this as the “one stock retirement” idea — their gross margins are still about 6% and their net profit margin about 2%, pretty much the same as they were in 2018.
And that massive US investment? It hasn’t really panned out. The centerpiece of that plan was a big display factory in Wisconsin that Foxconn agreed to build, in high-profile handshake ceremonies with then-President Trump, with promises of 13,000 new jobs and a renaissance in US high-tech manufacturing, and that plan seemed pretty snakebitten from the beginning. There is still a Wisconsin project for Foxconn underway, but it’s much smaller now, with hopes for maybe 1,500 jobs (there’s an interesting story here about how it all went wrong, if you’re curious). Maybe the latest push to “onshore” more technology manufacturing will mean yet more incentives to lure Foxconn to build facilities elsewhere in the US, we’ll see, but so far it’s not a meaningful factor for Foxconn’s earnings. What was touted as a $10 billion investment in factories by Foxconn was downgraded to an investment commitment of about $672 million in 2021. And as we’ve seen from Taiwan Semiconductor, it’s not necessarily easy to translate a Taiwan/China manufacturing strategy to the US, where workers and traditions can be very different.
In recent years, Foxconn has signaled that they plan to enter the electric vehicle business, competing with longtime auto industry outsourcers like Magna International (MGA). The highest-profile part of that was purchasing the former GM plant in Lordstown, Ohio that Lordstown Motors had previously bought for its electric pickup truck project — it’s essentially an outsourcing deal, Foxconn is buying the factory and will be contract-manufacturing the pickup truck for Lordstown Motors, and hoping to also manufacture electric vehicles for other companies who don’t have the manufacturing expertise. It sounded like a desperate ploy from an EV maker who had gotten in over its head, and Foxconn, unlike Lordstown, does have the resources to invest in building up the plant. Who knows, maybe they’ll be able to translate their skills to this new industry and get a new avenue for growth… but they haven’t yet, in large part because all the little EV companies they planned to work with have gone bankrupt (Lordstown, Fisker, etc.), and Apple has publicly acknowledged that their Apple Car project wasn’t going anywhere, and moved those employees to mostly AI work. Foxconn’s Lorsdstown factory is pretty quiet… last I saw, it was making electric tractors for Monarch
There is some potential for slightly better margins in the auto assembly business, Magna often has a 4-5% profit margin, versus 2-3% for Foxconn, but I wouldn’t count on Foxconn being great at this new business anytime soon, or building it up into something which would have a meaningful impact on their income statement. As they announced when they unveiled some prototype designs in 2021 (assembled by someone else), “Our biggest challenge is we don’t know how to make cars.”
I’m sure they can learn, but “we don’t know how to make cars” and “we don’t have any customers” is not a recipe for instant success.
And as to the “ChatGPT” connection? That’s pretty tenuous — basically, the argument is that because the growth of AI will lead to more demand for servers and more equipment in data centers, that FoxConn will be assembling a lot of those boxes and will therefore have big growth in that area.
Well, maybe. They are seeing rising demand for servers, so that’s true… but that’s a bright spot in a fairly tepid business right now. According to Reuters, about a year and a half ago…
“Foxconn Chairman Liu Young-way told the company’s annual shareholders meeting the firm remained cautious about this year due to monetary policy tightening, geopolitical tensions and uncertainty over inflation, but servers were a bright spot due to surging interest in AI.
‘More and more people are using ChatGPT,’ he said. ‘You can see the market for AI servers will rise much faster than expected. We expect that in the second half of this year there may be a three digit increase.’
“The Taiwanese company has a 40% global market share for servers and aims to further increase that, Liu added.”
According to that same Reuters update, Foxconn’s “cloud and network” segment, which includes their server assembly business, was 22% of revenue in their first quarter of 2023, and has been the real growth driver for the past year or so, with Foxconn now saying that AI servers will likely become their “next trillion-dollar business”. They’re doing a lot of cool things, including investing in satellite development, metaverse applications in their factories, and partnerships for automotove software and semiconductors, with the very first inklings of some margin improvement beginning to appear as AI-connected products and servers generate some more production volume, hopefully in this key holiday period and iPhone launch period underway now… but it’s really just an inkling so far, a good quarter after revenue had fallen for six quarters in a row.
I have a hard time predicting huge success for Foxconn in general, particularly because they’ve been in this rut of relatively slow growth and low (often declining) margins for a long time, but it’s certainly possible, and they are trying to expand into more businesses, particularly EV assembly, and are riding some growing demand for AI servers of late, even if they’re perhaps a little disappointed that the new iPhone 16 isn’t flying off the shelves as quickly as some hoped. You may well take my skepticism with, well, a bit of skepticism… maybe the “one stock retirement” hype from the Oxford Club and my skepticism can balance out a bit, and then you can go into your analysis fresh and unbiased and make your own call. I just keep coming back to these charts, which show the total revenue growth and earnings per share growth of Foxconn since those Alex Green ads started 2018 (the results are similar if you go back a decade or more, in case you’re curious)… which serves as a reminder that the surge in the stock this year wasn’t really caused by any growth in revenue or profit, it was driven by investors becoming more hopeful about AI servers, iPhones or other devices bringing some future growth.
It’s definitely a large and relatively inexpensive company, at about 16X earnings, so you’ve at least got that going for you… But there’s no rush, it’s been a cheap stock almost all the time for close to 15 years now, and 16X earnings doesn’t look so cheap for a low-growth company that has almost always traded in a range of 8-12X earnings, so the odds are pretty good that you’ve got time to think it over. Over the past two years of bull market, Foxconn has seen its PE ratio grow about twice as fast as the market’s (the Foxconn PE multiple is up about 80%, versus roughly 40% for the S&P 500 and for Apple, a little less than the 100% growth in the PE ratio for Taiwan Semiconductor). Clearly some improvements to investor sentiment… but we’ve so far had only one quarter of actually improving growth in sales or earnings.
So please do go forth, researchify for yourself, and let us know what you think about Hon Hai and its prospects for the next few decades. Just use the friendly little comment box below… and thanks for reading! I’ve left all the old comments attached below from our past updates to this story since 2018, to provide some perspective.
Disclosure: Of the companies mentioned above, I own shares of Amazon and Google parent Alphabet, as covered in my Real Money Portfolio. I will not trade in any covered stock for at least three days, per Stock Gumshoe’s trading rules.
You can buy HNHPF on td ameritrade. Fidelity would not allow me to buy that symbol.
Hi what is the most shares one can purchase? thanks
#HNHPF
Ureka, I think your personal finances determine the most shares you can purchase of any particular stock.
The reason most people are discussing the number of shares they are buying is because some brokers require you to purchase in certain increments, often starting at 1,000 shares.
TD Ameritrade doesn’t seem to have a minimum. Acer said earlier that E-Trade also allowed small buys.
The share price for HNHPF actually gives you 2 shares, which is why the price is different than the $3 Alex Greene mentions.
Thank you, I appreciate your response. To share , I am a student and unfortunately I don’t have the means to purchase 1000 shares, so learning about TD Ameritrade is good to know.
YES, HNHPF is the OTC symbol, Yet Does Not actually Trade under that Symbol (??) and HNHAF is under the London Stock Exchange where the shares you purchase, register….and YES HNHPF is 2 for Every 1 2317tt on TSE. I get Complete Quotes using HNHPF.. with HNHAF I get the Single Share price of $2.80 but it shows No Bid or Ask, only the Last Trade and Volume! Alex recommends using HMHPF and yet the HNHPF Symbol is Not the Symbol used (STRANGE) and was told it is not the ADR Symbol and is converted to HNHAF after purchase and held in your account under that symbol. Another symbol was mentioned, HNHD<<Why all the Meaningless Symbols??
Alex tells us it Can be Purchased using the Symbol HNHPF, this is Not True!
Some people will Never Be Able to make Alex's recommended stock purchase.
I Know I'm Out of The Game!!
I Tried purchasing 300 shares @ $4.80 on the HNHPF symbol (Would have got filled) and was connected with Schwab int'l and told I had to buy $3,000 on the TSE and an extra $100 in comissions, or 1,000 shares of the HNHPF witch would be done through London (HNHAF) and that HNHPF is Not an ADR, or the correct tradable symbol as Mr. Green says!
Unless you plan on buying 1,000 HNHPF or $3000 on tht TSE ….FORGET ABOUT THIS INVESTMENT —I Just wanted to Dollar Cost Average, But I Don't plan on Buying 5,000 Shares to accomplish that!
Those Minimums should have been part of the Article, or does Mr. Green assume everyone has $500,000 Accounts?
was quick and easy (low comission ) on amtd/TOS ..
I got what you said too in 9/2018. What should we do?
What should we do? I got HNHAF from Charles Schwab, can’t find HNHPF
k.ip, the new symbol for HNHPF is HNHPD, so use that in your research now. There was a reverse stock split recently, 5 shares of the old symbol are now 4 of HNHPD, and the share price is still down.
You’re probably on the wrong forum to get an answer to “What should we do?”
Alex Green would probably tell you to buy more….
Hi, finally what is stock symbol that Alex Green is suggesting?Is it HNHAF or HNHPF ? Please advise.
there are multiple listings for this stock… how do you know which one to buy, if you wanted to buy? why do some list no quote?
FXCOF FOXCONN TECHNOLOGY COMPANY LTD Up 0.00 (0.00 %)
HNHAY HON HAI PRECISION INDUSTRIES COMPANY LTD Up 0.00 (0.00 %)
HNHAF HON HAI PRECISION INC 2.27 Down -0.530408 (-18.94 %)
HNHPF HON HAI PRECISION INDUSTRIES COMPANY LTD 4.74 Up 0.11 (2.38 %)
HNHPF is a GDR (Global Depository Receipt) and is Reg S – is possibly a preferred… lists an x-dividend date. Does’t have that fantastic a yield either. i suspect the other is bought on the asian exchange via OTC markets, somehow… there may be a surcharge if you buy it from a us broker.
Just checked with TD Ameritrade. HNHPF is available $4.74 today, $6.95 comm. Been on a long slide since Jul ’17. Noticed increase in vol since Jul this year – Green’s doing?
I watch Jeff Brown the other night 3 times give the same speech. all the time he is saying and I am going to give that stock tonight. Like tonight no stock at end. every body was wondering what 5 dollar is it. After hours of searching all that was said i still had nothing at noon the next day, when finally we agreed we thought it was Nokia. I purchase a lot and now Alex used Nokia as a customer of the stock he is talking about. Why can’t we just get what it is, because i find myself still in the blind but with a lot of stock that seems now to be wrong. Good luck with this puzzle.
Jeff Brown’s teasing Nokia, Alex Green’s teasing Foxconn… neither one’s making anyone rich in the six months they’ve been touting ‘em, but expecting anything different is a little silly 🙂
Its the same old stuff from over a year ago Stay away
This presentation has snake oil salesman written all over it. There must be a sucker born every minute. The contract manufacturing industry is not a good business.
Very helpful and informative. It never ceases to amaze me the BS people advertise for profit!
Man, I wish I had come across this page FIRST . Definitely glad to know about this page now.
I became a member of the Oxford Club back in October. Before this I was in the process of an IRA setup from an old 403b, researching Schwab, TD Ameritrade, etc to use for the account. I liked both of the stated above but ended up setting up with TD Ameritrade.
Signed up for Oxford Club around the same time, slightly delayed, but ultimately received AFTER my funds transfer into TDA occured. Read through the welcome emails, finally got to the ” 1 STOCK RETIREMENT” portion.
First dissatisfaction point. The preferred and recommended method of purchasing this stock 2317 T T essentially can ONLY BE done through Schwab. It can be purchased through TDA as HNHPF, however this is NOT recommended by Green due to its low trading volume, however if it’s the only way you can get the stock then it will suffice.
I purchased 2000 HNHPF shares at $4.70 which through the GDR provides a 2:1 share ratio for roughly 4000 shares at $2.35 converted US dollars. The stock held briefly until trade woes pushed it down below the $4 mark. Meanwhile, Green sent out emails telling his readers to “remain calm” SPECIFICALLY regarding HON HAI aka FOXCONN as this was temporary and the stock was EVEN MORE primed for a “slingshot effect” which is a term he uses ALOT regarding his stock recommendations.
Green seems really attuned into the Foxconn world, as a few days later he announced again ( as the stock falls) that “good news is on the horizon”. Foxconn will shortly be announcing a surprise share restructuring and special dividend as part of the repurchase, i.e. buyback. This was GREAT NEWS as the shares would be worth more, and again primed for “slingshot”.
Well, as of Monday of this week HNHPF was locked out on my account for 24 hours, due to Corporate restrictions, locked prior at $4.02/share. When it reopened Tuesday, it now is listed as HNHPD and is 400 shares less. My 2000 shares were “restructured” into 1600 shares at $5.25/ share. This did reflect a 4.3% gain in share value from previous close, and I think this is the “special dividend” to which Green refers.
I don’t know what Foxconn has in its future. My personal tolerance is fairly low though.
As of this writing, share price is up to $5.46/share but still -$646 from initial purchase. I’ll sit for now, but my tolerance will be quite low on this one.
As for the rest of the service. I then began researching the Oxford Clubs “recommended stocks for potential 10x gains”, and overall portfolio recommendations.
Out of the “10 baggers”, I placed several in my paper trading account, thank God, and went with 2 of the recommendations. Those lost me, in addition to Foxconn above, over 3 grand since purchase. Out of the paper trades, only 2 remained positive.
I then got my FIRST Millionare maker recommendation. A tiny mining company poised for slow growth over time. By now, my BS detector is on alert. I slowly began researching this new one, and again only put it in my paper account. Time will tell on that one.
Oxford has several portfolios to choose from, however one consistency I’ve found throughout their archives and current topic threads is Alexander Green constantly telling his readers to “remain calm, the numbers still show…” on most of his recommendations. Why? Maybe because they seem highly speculative. Maybe because they aren’t performing. I can’t say.
I then came across a couple other services, including Zacks, and began REALLY looking into each of their recommendations and current holdings. Outside of BERK.B, well don’t really NEED a service on THAT recommendation, most were middle ground holds with several strong sells by multiple services.
Of note, after utilizing Zacks along with 2 other screeners, I’ve seen a 12% turnaround in new stocks, including the recent correction markets. So far, I now only hold Foxconn and Compass Diversified (CODI) from Oxford recommendations. As previously stated, I’ll most likely be very bearish with Foxconn.
As for Oxfords service, I’m not very satisfied currently. The constant inundation of emails pitching webinars to pitch another “can’t miss opportunity” to buy another product line is driving me crazy. I get more emails to buy new services than any for what I’ve already bought. Unless it’s an email making excuses for underperforming recommendations. By constant I’m talking 10-15 DAILY, all sales pitch.
I’m probably opting out soon, and we’ll see about their money back guarranty. I’ll come back to the thread on that one.
I’ve seemed to have had a better experience with their flagship service Money Morning, several recommended stocks through their VQ SCORE service have held steady. But, even that service is nothing but sales pitch after sales pitch.
Still looking for a good screener without breaking the bank.
lburson, I think most of us can relate to your sentiment of “I wish I’d found SG , or a particular article here, sooner.” (If you haven’t noticed yet, someone from Oxford Club also seems to read & comment here.) I actually find it easier to deal with Alex telling me to stay calm than with some of the other emails I get telling me to panic, and send them more $$ for more recommendations.
Among the group, it’s general practice to be more vague about your stock ownership, often referring to the percentage of your total $$ that you have invested in a stock. While I also own HNHPD, and share your frustrations, knowing you own 2000 shares tells me you play in a different league than I do, which I’m sure wasn’t your intention.
All the best with your paper trading and the real ones.
Catherine
Catherine, no it wasn’t my intention to imply to anyone on the thread that I “play in a different league” than you.
My illustration was simply for context of the change which just occurred for HNHPF in its merging into the secondary Hon Hai GDR traded on the London Stock Exchange, HNHPD, as well as the how the impact of share redistribution looked on paper.
Reading through several other threads, and one I believe related to Oxfords $3 stock, which I thought was this thread, I’d seen several posts stating number of shares ownedfor not only Foxconn, but others as well. Secondly, my investing and portfolio management style may be totally different than your personal style and/or risk tolerance.
As far as Oxford, yes the constant barrage of emails from Money Map and others are quite frustrating, and at times they completely contradict each other. One is doom and gloom pull out all your money, but buy this to learn where to put your money and the next is go all in on this newest blah-blah we’ve found, but buy this to learn how…
Infomercial quality sales pitch, nothing more.
Yes, I’ve also read the commentator from Oxford as well, and really not surprising that they follow the thread.
I actually started trading their recommendations on paper money after watching the HNHPF purchase begin to trend lower immediately after purchase. Seemed awfully akin to the pump and dump schemes.
Some have held, a couple have gained, but more have lost.
Thankfully I watched closely OTM.
Good trading.
I went thru this bull for a year and nothing . It nverre seems to materialize into anything I would call id a scam
BGedt away
Thank you for your honest and unbiased discussion on Foxconn. Your posting, explanation and review is welcomed by all investors and those that want to start investing. Keeping the discussion and honest will keep future investors interested and grounded.
TJC
Thank you Travis, I got this “pump” from Oxford club (ala Green) back in Aug… and then again more recently… so I have followed this stock since Aug… and… NOTHING!! It has barely even moved at all!… What a joke… Thanks again…
KJC, I’m not surprised that you think this stock has barely moved, because when HNHPF did a recent reverse stock split (5 became 4) and became HNHPD, it was barely acknowledged. So while the SP might look similar, it’s actually down 20%, isn’t it? I would expect it would be down somewhat on other exchanges too.
Alex Green does prefer buying on a different exchange, but I only wanted to dip my tow in, not buy 1,000 shares, so I own HNHPD.
where did you buy it? Ive been told I have to but a 2,500 position in the stock where I would only want to throw about 200 shares
You can buy it with E*TRADE under the ticker symbol HNHPD. Each share is actually two shares of Hon Hai perception when you buy this ticker symbol. The other way buying 2317 Is bought through international trading with various firms such as Fidelity but it’s more expensive when purchasing it this way. I bought some and it’s roughly $150 for the transaction completed and you have to buy 1000 Incremented shares. hNHPD Can be bought at any amount.
Hey Scott can you send me the link to purchase one trade if you don’t mind
Where can I buy into this stock safely
you have to buy it in blocks which is 1000 shares at a time it will be good long term talk is there thinking of building 6 to 9 companies across US but just heard theres some kind of delay?
But, Irregular, Green talked about dividends. Are you receiving dividends from this stock that make it worth it on that basis?
I think the indicated dividend yield is about 3.5%/yr., FWIW.
In his presentation, Green says about 5% annual dividend.
KJC, I am the “proof” of being “pumped up” from the Oxford Club at about the same time last summer that you heard the sales pitch. The only difference is that, [I am hesitant to say], I bought the shares and lost over $2,000.00 when the stock did a reverse split not too long after I had bought it…ugh! I waited a short time and decided to “get outta’ Dodge”, PDQ!
There is an article in “The Verge”, (2018), which has a pretty clear message, re the plans for the so-called ‘massive expansion’ of Foxconn… seems like there’s a good chance that it may NOT happen in the manner that was initially discussed
Recently the FOXCONN building is no longer going to house 13,000 workers but have 5,000 – 1,000 workers – mostly engineers. Foxconn’s thinking is it is too expensive to manufacture in USA.
Hey then write back to Oxford communiqué
Let’s see what he reply back to you. I own 700 shares as well and i can only little movement but they says it’s long term growth
I was told by Oxford to buy it under HNHAF which I did at $2.98 which I did about 6 months ago. Now it about $2.27 a 30% plus loss.
You probably will have to wait at least a year or two from now for HNHPD and HNHAF to take off. Foxconn has broke ground in Wisconsin and construction is there in a big way. I pass by there a few times a week and it is a big deal. It even effects about 10 miles of Interstate highway that is under construction. My guess is Foxconn will need to be up and running with good news to popularize the stock.
I put the ticker symbol in on schwab and got nothing any ideas?
I can get results on Fidelity on my Symbol HNHAF but i the result are old like 2 weeks ago
Call schwab global. Tell them to pull up ticker Hnhaf and purchase shares.
You have to call the International Trade Desk at Schwab.
I have already lost 30+ % On HNHAF plus when the stock split I lost 200 shares out of 1000 so now it shows 30& lost and 200 shares less. I cant beleive OXford is pushing this scam again
I agree. I have a loss of over $2,000 on $9,900+ since their reverse stock split which also changed my cost basis to $3.04/share!
I am seriously thinking of following up with Alex Green regarding this sales pitch…what a disappointment…I am truly at an impasse as just what to do. I WILL get a refund on my membership.
I have read and joined several “pitch sales” only to believe that the pitch is, or may be an inside pitch to boost personal
I decided, years ago that Oxford Club was an over hyped BS machine.
As for BS…watch Alex’s eyes as he talks. The man is a lousy liar. He blinks long and hard which is a well known “tell.”
Then, as soon as I saw the OC mentioned I came over here to see what Travis had to say.
As expected, the BS was confirmed.
Long and hard blinking is only valid during actual lying; afterwards when not lying they have to blink 8x faster than normal.
Scott, I might be better off dumping this dam stock. I can not wait for pie in the sky to come thru in 2 years. I just lost $1000 plus 20% lost on the stock split
Bought 5000 shares several months ago
Sunk a lot of money into this stock. Now with reverse split and stock frozen so can’t even sell it if I wanted to. Would just as soon cut my losses and run. Why it s he still trying to sell a newsletter tied to this crap stock. And I paid almost a hundred bucks in fees to buy it on the Taiwanese exchange. Big loser!!!
I am Chharli B I got hit bad too and if I could I would turn them in to the FTC. I was lucky I sold mine at about 40% loss and when I saw what you said I felt lucky. I am disgusted with The Oxford Clud
I share in each of your frustrations. I finally took my lumps, and reluctantly dumped this very questionable push by Alexander Green and Oxford Club.
Thankfully, I got out over 75% of my position earlier this month at a 11.5% loss.
I stayed in with the remaining 25% with a longer term focus which continued to devalue rapidly. Within a few days there were reports that Foxconn intended to ship workers in from Taiwan for the new plant in Wisconsin and the ADR share price dropped below $5.00. At the same time, production issues with Apple’s iPhoneX line continues to make headlines, and as a major component of that line the share price dropped again. I closed my remaining position at an 18% loss on the remaining 25% stake. Overall, I do wish I had closed completely at 11.5%, however I feel fortunate that my overall losses were held to 13% in total. Closing prices on HNHPD Tuesday hit 4.33/share, and had I stayed in 100% would have left a very sour 26% loss in my mouth.
So, today Foxconn announces
Apple assembler plans $2.88B in cuts https://seekingalpha.com/news/3411560?source=ansh $HNHAF, $HNHPD
Yes, 2.88 Billion in budget cuts, and layoff of 10% of non-technical staff as it faces “a very difficult and competitive year”. Overall, realistically the company has solid earnings and is a 51 Billion dollar company. So, the argument is valid, and time will tell. I’ll watch, and wait and maybe someday.
As far as the rest of the Oxford recommendations, only 1 of Alex Greens “Next 10 baggers” has shown minimal strength. Overall, in the short time I was with the Oxford Communique I wasn’t overly impressed, however outside of the Foxconn debacle I would have probably stayed on their service. I cancelled my subscription to Oxford Club, and as stated they refunded the subscription price.
Any frustration is coming from n00b ignorance in not understanding exactly what “retirement stock” means. It doesn’t mean one month, one year or even two years, it meants a decade and longer.
I’m very ignorant in the area of stock investments. Other than prepackaged stock portfolios through my employer, I have no experience with stock buying, trading or whatever the appropriate term would be. Even so, as soon as I heard Mr. Green refer to a stock with a “secret name” I realized I was wasting my time. Thanks for the article!
I wouldn’t call it a waste of time. Mr. Green isn’t the only analyst that said Terry Gou quietly built his empire Hon Hai Precision Industry (Foxconn).
I was intrigued by the presentation that Mr. Green; but as I was about to get ahold of the information the website went blank! I tried to get it back to no avail. I wish I knew how to get it back.
nurselisa, maybe I can save you $99. If you go to the top of this page, click on “Newsletters” then click on the 2nd choice, I think it’s “Teaser Tracking.” This shows how well each of the pushed stocks are doing. For some reason Alex Green is not listed under the editor column, so if you scroll down, the stock (HNHPD) is the first one with a blank space for editor, which makes it easier to find.
I bought mine above $5 (for the 2 shares), then there was a reverse stock split where you got 4 share for every 5 you had, and now the stock is falling with everything else….
Mr. Green writes for Oxford Communique, and if you type that into a search engine, I’m pretty sure you can find the website. Travis and other commenters have covered everything you need to know here though, free.
Stockgumeshoe dodges another bullet for me. I love this newsletter. It’s worth every penny.
We love you, too! Thanks Stephen
The Oxford Club membership package, which, after reading this article I am reluctant to do, promises information on how to get 10% return on Certificate of Deposits. Many, many retirees, or those who are close to retiring, would love to know about that. Does anyone have any information they can share on purchasing 10% CDs?
Don’t remember seeing that in the ads, but it’s been a while. 10% risk-free insured returns are impossible at current rates, I don’t know what risk they’re adding but they’re adding some kind of risk if they’re earning that return… could be currency risk (a foreign currency CD, some countries still have very high rates), non-insured risk (using LendingClub or something like it to do direct lending at higher rates), maybe inflation-protected CDs if you think inflation is about to soar, etc.
I’ll check and see if there were any clues in the latest ad I saw about what they meant by 10% CD rates… but those are “your money is at risk” returns.
Thank you.
Below is the offer they make. Number 2 is the 10% CD offer.
“You’ll also receive every one of the reports, books and special bonuses I’ve lined up for you today, including…
1) “The Single-Stock Retirement Plan: How to Retire on This Obscure $3 Stock” (Value $159)
2) “The 10% CD: The Safest Way to Collect Double-Digit Income” (Value $119)
3) “The Multimillionaire’s Handbook” (Value $129)
4) Beyond Wealth: The Road Map to a Rich Life (Value $21)
5) And the HD Video Set of “The Millionaire-Maker Private Sessions” (Value $199)”
That’s not enough clues to have any certainty, but my best guess would be that they’re touting peer-to-peer lending (like LendingClub, Prosper, etc.), which can provide 8-10% returns… though “safest” is a judgement call that I’m not sure I agree with. Oxford’s Income Letter posted a free note about this stuff here a while back: https://oxfordclub.com/reports/oxford-income-letter-juice-your-returns-by-128-with-this-big-bank-strategy/
Nodrog I’ll answer the 10% CD for you, and it’s not a CD. It’s an AVON corporate bond. If you’re really interested I’ll get you the “code” that is being teased on #2. I tried it on TDAmeritrade and it wouldn’t allow a purchase, although the rep who follows this site SWEARS it will. I’m not sure exactly why a history comes up on the bond, but won’t allow you buy, but regardless it was not very well rated hence the higher yield.
Hope this helps.
It was s bad stock. Lost 50 percent over last 9 months. Check out Foxconn. So called secret name. They are A Taiwan company with Apple as one customer. Check out the stock price movement. You can’t grt an accurate up to date figure.
Sorry to hear that. Theirs always a right time to buy.
Charles, you can’t find any information prior to November due to the reverse ADR split. Each ADR unit equals 2 shares, however with the split each ADR unit reduced to 1.6 shares effectively. The same happened with HNHAF as Foxconn purchased outstanding shares through partial share buyback with small dividend to “offset” the loss. The hope for the investor was that reduced outstanding shares would help stabilize the value and long term price.
Share price dropped after the split, and has remained in the 4.60 – 4.70 range for the ADR. Approximately a 20% drop pre-split.
Yes, I’m well aware of this happening and I dumped all my shares at about 45% loss considering the high cost/fees to buy and then sell the shares. Take a good look at the current declines of Foxconn.How many years will it take for them to show a decent gain.
Apple was nearly bankrupt in 1998. You would have sold then too.
I’ve come to this site to try to gain some knowledge on this stock before I purchased. I’m not trying to defend it or bash it but , For those losing money on the stock, are the rest of your stocks losing money as well? I know my other Investments aren’t doing well at this time.
I haven’t lost money on it lately. As most other stocks have been going down Hon Hai HNHPD and HNHAF have been holding their own. Staying steady right now. I own both and plan on buying more HNHPD.
thank you Scott doesnt anyone read ? Alex said possibly a year or two a forever stock .like ron popeii set it and forget it. all this Alex Green bashing….unbelieveable!!ive got 1600 down from 2000 on the reverse split. i sold netflix in its infancy coz it didnt grow fast enough for me. An oxford rec.I am NOT making that mistake again.Thank you.and good luck!